I own a 1983 Eldorado with 4.1L V-8, with 27,500+ miles.

I have spent more money than I care to admit having a local shop work in the brake system.

The biggest complaint (from the Mrs.) is the brake pedal travel too far and it is too hard to stop.

More back ground. I am in a wheelchair and I use a hand brake, so it is a little difficult to evaluate the same way as my wife, however, I do agree the car will not stop on a "dime".

To date I have installed the following, with little if any difference.

1. Rebuilt brake booster with master cylinder
2. New Front Brake Pads
3. New Rear Brake Shoes.
4. Rear Drum Kit
5. New brake hoses.
6. Self Adjuster repair kit.
He has some sort of a timed pressure tester and pressure stays up, i.e. no leaks.

The young man who has done the work is extremely nice and seems to know what he is doing, however, I would guess he has gone to this forum or one like it for input.
Not sure where to go from this point. I have considered installing after market disks on the rear, and if I was to do that? 1. Do I have to do both front and rear with after market disks? 2. Am I wasting my money and should look at something else to improve the brakes?

Thank you,

Equalizer in Big Sky



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How well does parking brake work? Does it go to floor or halfway?

Thank you for your interest and input.

The parking brake is good!!! Just goes half way.

I am told I either have all drum or all disk, so, I must have all "Drum".

I can pick up a set of used Disk Brakes for $300.00. Supposed to be complete set-up including method of attaching brake calipers to axel. Am I crazy?

Thank you,

Most 83 Eldo's had 4 wheel disc from factory, none of them would stop on a dime. I was at OLDs dealer at time car was built. Toro's at the dealer I worked at rarely had 4 wheel disc due to reliability issues. Check to be sure master cylinder is for rear drum. Combination valve could also be the cause. I know you have not had car long. Disc / Drum cars are very common. One last question: Does power assist seem like it working or is requiring more effort than it should?

I purchased the car 2 years ago on ebay. Thought I was getting a "Cherry". Wrong. Kept car in storage for a year and now trying to resolve all the problems. I got had and I should have known better. Shame on me.

The power assist seems to work somewhat, but my wife is not happy with the excessive brake pedal travel and slow stop time. She is a powerful ranch lady, so I do not hear about hard to push, she just feels they are not safe.

When we had more $ we owned a '98 Eldo and it stipped on a dime, now I can not afford that am trying to work with this '83. I need the big 2 door account of wheelchair. When I use my hand controls I can stop the car, but never get real close or up on someone elses bumper, i.e. I leave plenty of room to stop.

Everyone tells me to get rid of this 4.1L and find another 2 door with a different engine. Where do you stop or when do you say enough is enough.

Thank you for your input.

Any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

I have all service records from first owner and the brake problems/issues go back to 13,000 miles and 1992, when they were complaining about the same. Records show new shoes at 13,000 & clean drums. Then again at 21,000 2001, same problem.

From what you posted front brakes aren't working correctly. Combination valve can effect front brake operation, there is a valve within it which is designed to delay front brakes till rears have a chance to apply. If it's not working correctly front brake wont apply as they should. I would replace it before throwing in the towel.

Thank you. I will check that out next and will let you know.

I appreciate this forum, as I have learned and continue to learn. Sometimes even an old dog can learn.

Equalizer

I own an 84. This car has in fact, four wheel disc brakes. To verify the rear calipers are functioning normally, depress the parking brake with left foot and hold depressed, apply brake pedal with right foot. Then put car in gear. Release foot slowly from brake pedal, the car should remain still. If, with all your pressure on the park brake, the car creeps forward, rear brakes are NOT working. That would account for low pedal the wife's complaining about. The rear brakes adjust for normal pad wear by religious use of the parking brake every time the car is parked. As the park brake is pushed, it will rotatethe caliperpiston, ratcheting out to make up wear clearance. On a car this old, usually from lack of use, the rear caliper adjusters seize and require two rebuilt calipers be installed. At the inboard side of the caliper, the parking brake cables attach to an arm. As the arm rotates forward with park brake application the piston rotates within the caliper. If its seized it will not allow the piston to stay out taking up the clearance. SO, verify, verify and then replace rear calipers, flush the brake fluid and adjust the park brake by the factory manual.

ORIGINAL: equalizer

Thank you. I will check that out next and will let you know.

I appreciate this forum, as I have learned and continue to learn. Sometimes even an old dog can learn.

Equalizer


keep at it, provide the details as you go through diagnosis and the guys will surely help you get your car working as it should. Dont give up.
Some of us also learn from what others have to endure.

This is a good thread & i'm tagging it FAQ ...

Most people do not know the importance of the parking brake and never use it. Not only keeps rears adjusted but keeps car from "rocking" which isn't great for the tranny.

G.A.R.Y.

Carnut's post will apply to all GM 4 wheel disc. exept vette. From the mid seventies on, where parking prake cable attaches to rear caliper. Parking brake on cars with early "clock hand" calipers type need regular use, to keep rear brake pads adjusted. Vette always has had parking brakes shoes under rear rotor. GM "new platform" cars and trucks have moved to the parking shoe under the rotor as they appeared after 2000.

Thanks Guys!!! for the input. I feel like an old fool, but I now know for sure I have Disks Brakes X 4, as my son helped me remove front & rear wheels to check.

I tested holding down the parking brake & foot brake, then putting into gear and slowly letting off of brake pedal. The Parking Brake would not and did not hold the car in place. (Not even close).

I will dig into the rear calipers and notify you of results.

This really helps.

Now I have to post a new question, as the windshield wipers and washers will not go off. My wife is so happy with this car, I may need to find a new place to sleep.

OK, status report. rebuilt calipers have been installed on the rear, flushed and adjusted. Some improvement. The parking brake will now hold the car when in gear. That is the good news.

Bad news, still a lot of pedal travel and my wife now says the pedal is very hard to push and she now prefers to use my hand control rather than the foot brake. I had my 29 year old son drive & test the brakes, he confirmed the brakes are very hard to puch and understands why mom & wife are complaining.

I would guess the next step is to look at the Vacuum Booster. If you agree with this are there any after market kits available that can give this item extra Boost???

I have changed out the Power Booster. This did not make much if any improvement other than causing the brakes to lock up after driving the car about 5 to 7 miles. I added one washer between the Power Boost and Master Cylinder and that appears to fixed that.

I am posting this and also apologizing to all of you, as I had asked about the brakes when I was talking or being helped with the cruise control. So, I am posting this info to bring everyone up to speed. This is what I posted on the Cruise Control Thread.

Reporting in. It appears I have the Power Boost and the Locking up problems resolved. 1. The power boost was purchased from NAPA and the rod on back side of the unit was not adjustable. I ended up purchasing 2 washers from local hardware store, approx. thickness 56 thousands, and placing them between the Booster and Master Cylinder. Have driven over 50 miles and no problems. The brake travel and pressure on the brake pedal is about the same, perhaps 5% less.

I have taken the car back to the local garage, who did the initial work on the brakes and asked them if the rear calipers were adjusted with the parking brake cable disconnected and he said yes!!! He also inspected all 4 rotors and pulled pads from passenger side front and rear, they are not GM Pads, but NAPA pads purchased last year. They looked very good.

It was suggested I consider and install a "Residual Pressure Valve" on each line. I have done a little research and have a general idea of their concept or how they should work. What are your thoughts??

It looks like I have pretty well rebuilt the brake system including the "Combination Valve" The car will stop, but it still has a long pedal travel and my wife continues to complain the pedal is too hard to push. At the begining she was not complaining about how hard it was to push. I use "hand Control" for the Break and have the handle set-up so that I get an extreme amount of force on the brake, i.e. the rod on my hand control is very close to the pivot point, which give me a lot of extra power.

My wife can use the hand control, but it is not natural to her, where I have been using a hand brake for over 40 years. I need to make her happy with the foot brake.

Again, I thank all of you for sharing your time and experience.

Not sure where to go next other than the "Residual Pressure Valve" again I am not sold on that, it just suggested.

Equalizer

Again, I really appreciate your input.


Equalizer

wow. this thread is smoking hot. Keep it coming equalizer. The guys are giving us great info about brake problems. Never had one but this will help me.:)

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I felt good to have a Centerforce clutch (http://www.partstrain.com/ShopbyBrand/Centerforce) and the safety of my Centric brakes (http://www.partstrain.com/ShopbyBrand/Centric).